Is this the right workflow?

[Chemogen]

I'm quite active in the local Psytrance scene as a producer, and would like to get involved in the visual side of events.

I have a good idea of what a VJ does at parties, by using a vision mixer to mix together different abstract images in time with the music...But these are usually computer generated fractals or edited stock footage.

Anyways, I'm a film student with broadcast quality equipment and I'd like to contribute to the Psy scene creatively so I figure I can actually put my gear to good use here by filming Psytrance visuals that can be screened against a DJs set or live performance. Ie, a performer gives me their set and I go out to film imagery that suits it before manipulating the live footage with PC effects so they end up with visuals that truly suit their music.

I'm going to go out and do one for one of my tracks to see how it works, but do you think it's a service that could be put to good use in the scene?

In terms of live VJ performance:

I have broadcast quality equipment and industry standard editing software so I'm wondering how I'd do this.

I'd like to film real - but arbitrary footage - that I can piece together in my edit suite, adding effects and manpulation, to form a music video of sorts (in studio, not realtime.)

I'm guessing I'd then split the images in that video to separate clips and then use a live VJ mixer like Arkaos to trigger those clips at different times, and add different effects onto them if needed?

That's all cool for live footage, but how does one go about getting that abstract, psychedelic fractal stuff to use in between the live clips? Would something like Arkaos be able to generate them natively?

[stulloyd]

Have a look at Whorld, generates Fractally type stuff.

stu

[vjrei]

Well...

You are doing what most VJs wants and you are going to face the same situations.

If good you have your equipment and footage, all that is fine... as long you do not expect to get an income from it.

Usually if you are going to perform in a club promoters just do not care about your expensive equipment just because you do not produce money for them. So basically is up to you and for them having a DVD or a tv station would do. The audience and the DJ may like your work but they won't pay you anything neither.

So, there is when reality strikes and you start to turn your creativity into a business.

For you to get paid will need to create a name and play at every single places for about a year or two.

That si reagrding the economics, then the technical side...

Arkaos will work depending on the system you are running in. There are software for mac and for PC with different effects and capabilities.

The best way to learn is to get out and start from scratch doing your visuals on the field. Then come back here.

[Chemogen]

Do you think a DJ would pay to have a video produced that complements his set? Not mixed in real time, but an abstract video that has edit suite precision and polish to be played alongside his audio? Also, is there anyway to rip some of the visuals from the Winamp Milkdrop Plugin? It would be awesome splicing some of those graphics into a video.

[WordVirus23]

Originally Posted by vjrei

as long you do not expect to get an income from it.

NNNNOOOOOO!!
bad monkey rei!!
don't expect to get money... DEMAND IT!
be sure that the club or promoter understands that you're dragging out 1000's of $$ in gear... and that there is no such thing as a "free show"... much like there's no "free lunch". Have this discussion BEFORE the gig starts... no one is a good business man at 3am when they've been drinking/etc.
Remember, it's fun too... but don't walk away empty handed (or worse!)

[WordVirus23]

Originally Posted by Chemogen

Do you think a DJ would pay to have a video produced that complements his set? Not mixed in real time, but an abstract video that has edit suite precision and polish to be played alongside his audio? Also, is there anyway to rip some of the visuals from the Winamp Milkdrop Plugin? It would be awesome splicing some of those graphics into a video.

problem being... every DJ I know (quite a few) never plays *exactly* the same set... hence your "edit suite precision and polish" would be off sync and not match... you're much more likely to pitch a DVD to a DJ as a generic title/promotional DVD... as for what to charge... the concensus here is: as much as possible while still keeping the client on the hook.

RE: winamp viz. look for the Patchbox plugin... otherwise, capture, edit, repeat until desired effect is achieved.

[vjrei]

Originally Posted by Chemogen

Do you think a DJ would pay to have a video produced that complements his set? Not mixed in real time, but an abstract video that has edit suite precision and polish to be played alongside his audio? Also, is there anyway to rip some of the visuals from the Winamp Milkdrop Plugin? It would be awesome splicing some of those graphics into a video.

My friend... the reality of DJs worldwide are this.

1. FatBoySlim is the only one as far as I know that has a VJ, FBL are 4 people actually, the DJ, the VJ, the technical director and the Manager.

2. The other person is Tiesto and is not a bif deal, just a DVD and one song as a DVJ.

3. And I forgot... Sandra Colins with Vello (VJ V2) who really does something.

The rest of the 3 million DJs around the world just do not care and if they care they will tell you to lower your rates.

DJs do not bring their equipment 99% of the times.
DJs do not have to isntall anything 6 or 24 hours later.
DJs do not play all night long as you do.
DJs do not create their material per show.
DJs do not install proyectors or plasmas, they do not care how many speakers are there.
DJs finds speakes every where they go, 99% of the clubs do not have screens.

So their world is totally different, they like visuals like everybody else but I would like a personal trainer too.

Regarding the music sync.... that si a talent you have to develop, to sync your mind with the music and have material ready by the time changes comes. Is not only having good material, is knowing how to link that amterial to the beat.

I once used the same logo for hour and a half in a show, I was so attach to every beat, every silence and people felt it. The atmosphere got tense because people knew what I was traying to do... doing visuals withe the same shape and people where exited as hell. I used basically every single effect on that logo, I had 3 computers with teh same logo runing Arkaos, Modul8 and Motion Dive 3, plus 2 V4... enough expresion. It was good.

But the only way for you to find out abaou eevrything is on the road as I told you. Hit the road.

[asterix]

Chemogen welcome to vjf.
I'm a psy addict myself but prefer my uplifting morning proggy these days. As a vj you'll never get a playlist from a dj, its more about thier style (even though psy dj's will go from one extreme to another over a set).

You can go two ways about this:
Rip a few dvds of content that will overlay and blend nicely - and use your video mixer to switch between both. With psy you can usually run four fast gradient switches at the end of each progression with a few cheaky ones in between. Don't go overboard with it though.

OR

Software mixers will allow you to add more dynamic elements such as live audio driven effects, tempo increases/decrease, precise bpm switching etc etc etc. To do this you'll need to produce a heap of smaller clips (no more than 10 seconds in length) and a software solution that will fit the unique style you'll develop as you practise.
You can find basic software comparisons at the link below. Each one has its unique features, benefits and most importantly - interfaces designed to streamline what you like doing most.

Anyhow - download some demos (if your on mac Im loving vdmx) and play around. That way you'll quickly find out whats possible and what you'd like to be possible. Then ask questions where you get stuck (this forum is vj gold).

[Chemogen]

Thanks a lot guys.

I'd like to get involved in Psytrance creatively one way or another and being a film student, VJing seems like a cool avenue to go down.