3d neural nets

[MJS2020]

Hi, i was wondering which softwares could be used to make those vids that seem to me like 3d neural nets.
Some warp videos (second bad vilibel by autechre) use this type of graphics.
I've thought of 3d studio and afterfx but i can't figure how these softs could do that type of thing...
Any help would be greatly appreciated
mjs2020

[fuussmuuss]

i dont see what you mean? :confused:

[holly]

Post a screen-capture.

[syzygy]

You can watch the video in question online:

http://www.clipland.net/Summary/923861301/Autechre-Second-Bad-Vilbel.html

[PiedPiper]

i have a 3d rendering /flyby of a build tree of the linux kernal.
all of the diifferent classes are interconnected by pathways, so it makes for a 3d mesh in space look
got it form slashdot originally...

i *think* that is kind of what your talking about???

I intend to use a bit of nueral nets in some image recognition stuff i am programming for work but, i cant think of any way to make a 3d neural net look interesting....

then again, maybe with a bit of work some colors for the nodes....

[syzygy]

the site linked to through that link seems to be down at the moment.

The video is also available through nams:

http://www.namsnet.com/directory/

but note you will need to download their player to view the (low res, highly compressed) video.


Not sure where the 3D neural nets are in that video... It's mostly affected DV footage and a 3D render of a robotic beastie.

Dan.

[holly]

Yes, I know the video but I haven't a clue what the "neural nets" are in it. Maybe MJS could post a pic of what s/he wants to do and we could offer suggestions to get similar interesting fx...?

[syzygy]

Originally posted by PiedPiper

I intend to use a bit of nueral nets in some image recognition stuff i am programming for work but, i cant think of any way to make a 3d neural net look interesting....

then again, maybe with a bit of work some colors for the nodes....


If you made each node of the network a light source (I don't know much about modern 3d render engines, bu tI imagine having thousonds of lights would impact render times... ) , you could get some really nice effects by turning the nodes on and off depending on whether they are activated,

Back when I studied artificial intelligence, I saw some great demos of forward and back propagation in neural networks where you could actually see the activation sort of rippling through the network.

If the links between nodes glowed acording to the values they were passing between nodes then that would be even better...

Dan.

[MJS2020]

Hey guys, I'm sorry, I didn't explain myself so I went out and got a picture of what I'm talking about.
The clip I was thinking about wasn't actually Second bad vilibel but a video I downloaded with music by Tom Jenkinson (Squarepusher) and video by Kaspar Daugaard and Stefan Mylleager title should be "the exploding psychology"... at least I was right on Warp records.
I attached an image to this post. Resolution is not that good but it will give you an idea.
The rest of the video is good too 3d but i guess most of it could be done with some good particle generation in afx or something.

So: basically my idea is having a camera fly through somebody's brain seeing all the connections. Something like what syzygy was saying about artificial intelligence.

I probably need some 3d software plugin to model this type of thing for me... can't imagine doing it by hand...

The autechre gantz graf video also has some interesting 3d in it wonder how that was done..
thanks, mjs2020

[Exavior]

This is not exactly what you want, but it may help direct you toward the right path. There is a program named ?Walrus? you may want to look into. It creates 3D node trees.

http://www.caida.org/tools/visualization/walrus/gallery1/ries-t2-thumb.png
http://www.caida.org/tools/visualization/walrus/

I?m not sure if they have any download links at the moment... When I got my copy I had to email them. I just told them what I do and how I intended to use their application. The application was free, and they support its use as an artistic tool.

Enjoy.

[syzygy]

That squarepusher still looks like it might have been made by duplicating an element a lot of times and layering it on top of itself...

MJS2020 - is it the complexity of the scene that makes you wonder how it was done?

If I were setting out to make something that complex, I would create an element that I could reproduce many times to make the whole. In all likelyhood, I would end up wiritng a script to do the donkeywork.

Dan.

[MJS2020]

The randomness of the video makes me wonder how it was done more than the complexity.
The still may look like a bunch of lines but the video is really complex, these lines connect points in space and change perspective with the camera moving.
Also, they are not really straight lines but more organic bumpy tubes...
Maybe i just need to get into advanced 3d modeling... i know nothing of scripting for 3d...
I'm not necessarily searching for a tool that will make that anim FOR me although it would be helpfull (i'll take a look at walrus, thanks exavior), I would like to understand how that can be done.
Same for the gantz graf vid... it looks like they somehow linked some audio parameters to 3d parameters.
I know of afx's convert audio to keyframes but how can you do that with 3d objects?

[syzygy]

Originally posted by MJS2020

Same for the gantz graf vid... it looks like they somehow linked some audio parameters to 3d parameters.
I know of afx's convert audio to keyframes but how can you do that with 3d objects?


Gantz Graf is not so automated as you might think...

http://www.warp-net.com/news/news_search.php?ti_id=512&search_string=Alex%20Rutterford

Basically, the video director did it mostly through labour intensive manual linking of the video to the audio.

Dan.

[charlielangridge]

Dunno if this is of interest to you

http://www.opte.org/

A map of the internet :)

[choimation]

This looks like an After Effects Comp using vectormasks and trapcode's 3dstroke plugin. Probably with some rotation, motion blur and echo applied to it. Can easily be synced to distinct audio levels using Trapcode's sound keys. Auras and things like this are very easy to produce in AE especially with trapcode's and Genart's Sapphire plugins.

Motion makes it easy as well, this could even be a partical generator from particular 1.01

Christian
The Choimation Image Factory, Inc.
www.choimation.com

[choimation]

Originally posted by MJS2020
I know of afx's convert audio to keyframes but how can you do that with 3d objects?

1. Use Trapcode's Sound Keys plug in.
2. Map out the various frequencys you want to isolate.
3. Figure out the paramater of the filter in 3d space you would like to follow along with the music.
4. Create an expression by clicking option stopwatch in the parameter's key.
5. Pickwhip the expression to the soundkeys output keyframes. Hit enter.

Bob's your uncle you are now oscillating 3d parameters in after effects using a musical frequency.

Easier said then done but with a bit of experimentint, you'll figure it out.

Christian Choi
The Choimation Image Factory, Inc.
www.choimation.com