??Should there be a VJ Magazine??

[Lucidhouse]

Sounds like this subject could be a hot potato, but really I don't see why there shouldn't be a VJ mag out there...Intrest in what we do is growing and I think the time is good

To be honest we should all do what we're good at,, and publishing is not my field, but if a quarterly VJ mag where to be published, it would be shit if it was done by someone who knew little on the subject and was doing it purely as a commercial egotistical enterprise. Ideally it should come from this online community, with some profits going back into it...

As usual some peeps on this forum will question it, witch is good ...

For me one of the main functions of a VJ mag would be to raise the profile of our artform.

Some key words would be: professional, aesthetic, informative, useful, hip

Having worked in advertising, I would be happy to do the branding/logo design for first cover lay out.
(in fact I'll design a cover/logo anyway and see where it goes from there)

The variations and approaches are endless, so I've narrowed it down with a poll.

Personally I'm curious and just trying to kick this off,...might happen, might not, it's worth a shot.

Who can offer their Ideas and services?

[Kyle]

I agree with Lucid. I like the midrange with CD or DVD. I remember going to raves and parties and getting local magazines about DJs and whatnot. Some were free and some were a few dollars. Some lasted and some did not. What I remember most is that the magazines were mostly localized. With VJ Forums I get to sit in a virtual room with likeminded people from all over the world. I think something on paper like this forum is an excellent idea. What are we waiting for?

So what kind of problems did Infopocolypse run into? I would love to hear what he has to say.

[seex]

I think its a great idea, this way the more visualy awere clubs and festivals culd be exposed, and in my experience visuals are more and more the thing tahat brings people to the event. Having a big visual crew is unfortunaly only a sign of good production and qality selection of performers unstead of a ripoff. But this culd change with a magazine vj-s culd be promoted as serious performers or stars that also atract crowds and make proper fees.

I imagine ther wuld be interest to advertise clubs and evnts and also softwere and gear, finding more of these is probaly a good way to make it into a glossy with a dvd suplement.

Id subscribe anytime

[holly]

I'll support whatever you decide. Contribute to the words and the vids, too.

Go for it! I just suggest you start small, and don't create a model that relies on advertising to make a profit (at first at least).
:yep:

edited to add
I didn't vote because I would actually support a cheaper format than DVD: I'd suggest a monthly CD-rom. Less content, cheaper, more frequent.... With the magazine on-disc in PDF.

[sleepytom]

yep i'm with holly on this one - a monthly or bimonthly xplatform cdrom with some video clips and a few articals as pdf or html would be a very good start

i'm happy to write some articals / do some testing and reviewing for this - i can also help out with the technicalitys of the cdrom (or dvd) authoring.

a product such as this would be a good no risk testing ground for a possible future print mag - we would at least get some stats on the likely market for such a product.

this could be a great way to build up VJCentral as the articals could all be posted there a couple of months after the disk is released.

[charlielangridge]

Im with Holly and Tom on this one and of course i will be up for writing articles etc. Also we could do the codec comparison with loadsa the same video files so people could compare the differences themselves :)

[Esotic]

I would fully support (with time and effort) the creation of a DVD "magazine" as often as content dictated.

I'm a quality whore. Plus I just got DVD architect 2 and am drooling at any opportunity to put it to use. :)

We already have a mechanism for sharing "articles" (being the VJCentral and VJForums sites) so putting them on distributable media seems irreleveant. If we're distributing something it's cuz it's too bandwidth intensive to post (i.e. hours of high quality video content).

Video is the whole reason we are here, right?

So for "articles" (html and pdf) why not just dedicate a portion of VJCentral to VJMag and organize a collection of informative, instructional, and releveant content with a main page once a month or so?

-King Blabbermouth

[topherz]

Cool idea!

One question is, who is the audience?
VJs, or VJs and visually interested people, or random clubbers, or..other.

And, what is the goal?

I would be interested in something geared towards visually interested people. Content focussed on VJs and other progressive visual *stuff*. One good goal is just to have fun making stuff, another one that i suspect alot of people here are interested is generating more interest in visuals...making it more accessible.

As to content. I like content that I can enjoy away from the computer. reading at the club, on the tram, in the park, or on the pot is good. CD is a good idea because of the cost, but it would be nice to have VideoCD content that can be played on DVD player. Again, its just nice to crash in front of the big tube and get visualized rather than have to click and point and interact all the time. :) Must be a good VideoCD format, I know most players can do "SUPER VCD" format... maybe they even support DVD quality? not sure. Of course its nice to have some computer content as well.

-topher

[littlecatalyst]

ok im gunna be a little businesslike here, we ought to look at precedents.

1) channel zero. before GNN they tried to do a video magazine and it bombed. there are numerous problems with doing that, even on a quarterly basis, people are used to magazines in paper (or a la 60 minutes on tv), and then theres the whole issue of distribution... if its something that can't be stacked between other magazines its a pain for them and they will shy away.

there are a lot of these mag+disc combos now and this would be amazing for our work, you can read, see glossy pics and then pop in the disc (which obviously would have showreels and feature artists, but can also have trial versions of VJdemos, one a month would be great.....)

2) we ought to look at Vice magazine also, something that has built (deservedly or not) street cred, and started out small but with its international network, managed to cover local distribution on a massive scale, and shot up real nice....

i don't think its a mistake to consider revenue ads. i mean what ur talking about is a business, not art nor party ambience, right? so you gotta get revs. only mistake would be to go after industry advertising exclusively (sure adobe/apple will want to buy a page, and prolly Moonshine..) but the real money is in the lifestyle ads: vodka redbul, clothes, electro releases, seed-banks and hedshops, major raves..... we should definitley give daveaudiovisualizers a backpage ad for real cheap (come on he's a trooper!) so we can totally look like a dj mag with one of those "all your VJ needs" ads with the mini pics....

it's bound to happen, a mag. and it will be something that will totally totally bring about a hightened awareness umong the mass culture about what it is all about ....im fine with any format and think it will be great, but just feel that people are used to the magazine format, and now getting into the mag+disc, and one day maybe the media will shif to the point where the fetishised object is no longer a part of it and we can all dl every magazine we subscribe to , in the interim its the print format that rules...

besides, of the values issues happen (like ethics and all that), we can make ourr own descisions as to what type of sponsors are not going to get to lease our mental real-estate (ie: Vice refuses tobacco ads, thats their policy)
and even ecological issues, (there are HOT papers now made of knaf, hemp etc so you dont havta kill the trees). with the network available (for DIY distribution) and the medium as rich as it is dvd+mag is my vote! (I wanna see glossy shots of the Big Chill... some of the mega dope installations... the centerfolds!!)

sadly i diagree with holly charlie and tom, three people i do not like to disagree with

[Esotic]

I really dig what the VJTV.net peeps are up to, but hate that the quality of the transmission is just barely acceptable.

I'm not big into mags other than product catalogs, but I totally agree with topherz about having it away from the computer (if you're into that sort of thing).

It kinda sounds like the VJCentral peeps could make use of a couple different mediums and distribution mechanisms depending on thier personal tastes.

I think I'm gonna go start a thread now. :)

-Esotic

[Esotic]

http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?threadid=5486&perpage=15&pagenumber=1

I'll get off this thread now.

I'm still willing to contribute time and effort to making things happen. Just let me know.

:D

[sleepytom]

in responce to littlecat

i simply don't see this thing selling through any of the normal magazine distrobution chanells - i'm imagining a production run of maybe 250 disks - mail order only - posted out by someone. - it is not an cannot (yet) be big enough to sell in any shops (and ummm which shops do VJs go to??) - the disks will need to be priced at a break even cost covering level - to attempt to make any money from this would be foolish at this early stage.

topherz asks the key questions - who is the audiance? - for me the answer to that is "us" - ie the people that are reading this VJs and people intrested in VJing who use the web and can manage to buy something online - the audiance is not the genral clubing public (we're talking a specialist magazine here with more indepth tutorials and reviews, interviews etc etc - it should be written at a level that we find intresting not dumbed down for public consumtion)

[asterix]

Tom right about distribution. Ummm how many members do we have access to here? 250's a pretty pessimmistic estimate though :jump2: but a good minimum to base a production run on.

(Knowing that makes it piss easy to pitch advertising subscription also - which means most of your overheads are free :). )

PDF will die in the arse for sure - we already have electronic media available to print. I never have...


It sounds positive in here - can we perhaps have interested parties post thier interest in participating? Particularly someone with some advertising sales skills.

I dont' mind helping to form a framework and doing some dtp/graphic design. PM me if your'e interested.

[elbows]

From the estimates of scale expressed so far, the business model to look at would be that of the fanzine I guess. Dunno what there is these days, or what it was like in the rest of the world, but there were lots of fanzines knocking about in the home computer nerdery category when I was growing up in UK in the 80's.

Speaking purely of my own opinion, I am less than interested in bits of paper and snailmail. More video!

[holly]

I'm with Tom. -- we can always print more. I'm not trying to be negative, but actually positive! They'll sell faster if there's a bit of limited availability, no? Plus encourages us to make more volumes, rather than just more copies of the same issue....

[sleepytom]

yep the psychological bennifits of not having hundreds of the bloody things sat around your house with no chance of them ever being sold are great (does anyone want any of the avit software demo disks we made - theres still hundreds of them knocking about)

elbows is right - allthough discribing fanzine production as a "business model" makes me laugh :)
ultimatlly the reason fanzines work is they are run by dedicated people who want to produce something and aren't too bothered about the economics of it all (ie they will work for free and be plesently supprised if they break even)

i would be extreamlly suprised if a product like we are discussing would attract any advertising income - perhapse VJ software companys would pay a very small amount of cash for an advert? but beyond that i feel it should really be self financed (ie the cover price should cover duplication and distrobution) - this would realistically set the cover price at somewhere around ?4-?5 ($7-$9 usd) - would people pay this much do you think?

[Amukidi]

No - half of them would rip it from their mate's.

I think that the ups and downs have been covered here, so I guess in true forum fashion, folks will now start repeating themselves:) Running a specialist interest publication is NOT for the faint hearted - anyone here that takes up this mantle can definitely forget about doing anything else, as these things completely take over your life. As Tom rightly points out, only VJs will be interested in it - unlike DJ mags, where the general public will buy them for record reviews etc. So your target audience is VJs and wannabe VJs - thismight work in the US, by pure force of numbers, but I rather doubt it as there is so little common ground to hang a theme on.

Elbows said: "I am less than interested in bits of paper and snailmail. More video!"
God what a grim outlook - I'll do anything to pull myself away from this fucking CRT - any written document more than a page long gets printed off, so I can read it properly. How many people would go into a newsagents and buy "Private Eye" or "DJ" magazines if they were on CD rom or DVD? sure, paper needs to be controlled, but billions more throwaway bits of plastic we do NOT need. Remember - we can always plant trees - we cant make any more oil.

[paradoxewan]

to be fair, this is a nice idea, but old technology.

we already have an interactive "magazine" here, with instant reply and response.

What would be more impressive is to see the articles appearing here.

There is a reason that every major paper in the uk is throwing out dvds, and spending vast amounts of money on websites, thats is that they know that instant news/content is the way forward. Whats the point in publishing something that will be out of date as quickly as it is made? Espec in this fast moving industry.

I see alot of people getting excited about it, but to be fair i don't see any real gain from it, other than proving who has the biggest projector this month, and i dont think enough people will support it. I love dj mag, IDJ, Total Production, but i dont buy them every month- as all the information is here online anyway,

It would be far better to see the time and effort going into content for here, in depth reviews, products ect. Perhaps get some deals going with some software companies.

As for the DVD, fair enough content - great idea, showreels brilliant, but why not charge a small membership fee for this site, and do all that, would be far easier to gather material, and production costs are then down to either DVD and shipping, or media storage of an image file on a server.

Another major problem, if this was to be made for the general public- is keeping them interested. Most of the dj mags are based arround the lifestyle and music tastes of headline acts. We (as vj's - dont a- have the same lifetyle, b, same number of headline acts)
Would the general public be in the slightest bit interested in VJ T-Bar mixing at his local club? i don't see it.

[Amukidi]

"we already have an interactive "magazine" here, with instant reply and response."

Yeah, but we often have to wade through a lot of shit to get to the good stuff - and its on a fucking computer, which I, for one, don't want to be a slave to....
I know I'm an old fart - but some of you lot need to get out more!

[paradoxewan]

Originally posted by Amukidi
"we already have an interactive "magazine" here, with instant reply and response."

Yeah, but we often have to wade through a lot of shit to get to the good stuff - and its on a fucking computer, which I, for one, don't want to be a slave to....
I know I'm an old fart - but some of you lot need to get out more!

coming from a VJC Editor says alot really.

Surely its just a case of structure, and moderation?

With a bit of clever site design, it could even print off into magazine form to keep you "old farts" happy.

Either-way magazine, or ezine someone is still going to have to wade through the shit.

The question is how long before the novelty of the glossy mag wears off?

[Rovastar]

I would welcome it in printed forum. I spend too long in front of a computer screen.

[holly]

May I suggest a simple experiment. A few were interested in design layout, and it's been mentioned that there is a wealth of content sitting on VJc/f that might be better featured. Would maybe a few of you do a mock-up frontpage that included "featured" links to pages within the site? We could all give feedback and some of these issues might become obvious/irrelivant. Plus no investment at first besides time.

HTML and PDF can always be printed by the user. Personally I'm not "old Fart" enough to read newspapers. I get all my news electronicly....

I'd still be interested in contributing more complex "stories" and articles, but VJc is a bit limited in its presentation.... An alphabetical list of how-tos, FAQs, and press releases isn't really a magazine. I think there's a need for something a little more current and personalized - not to mention a LOT more visually stylish. Last I checked you can't include an IMG tag within a VJc article.... I tried, it didn't work. VJf is actually more friendly to "installments" and providing images within the body of the text....

[elbows]

Originally posted by Amukidi

Elbows said: "I am less than interested in bits of paper and snailmail. More video!"
God what a grim outlook - I'll do anything to pull myself away from this fucking CRT - any written document more than a page long gets printed off, so I can read it properly. [/B]

Theres nothing grim about my opinion thanks very much, it simply boils down to personal preference as I clearly stated in my post. I enjoy reading from the screen, I prefer paper for reading book-length stuff but nothing else. Each to their own, as you said you print out stuff you want to read so fair play - whats the problem?

My personal opinion is based as much on a dislike of the distribution of physical goods and the time it takes to receive them, its not a save the tree rant.

As for bringing oil into it, well it takes plenty of energy resources to produce paper other than trees, and the distribution of information on physical material is not as energy-efficient as the internet. Im not asking for a cdrom or DVD based magazine, I am not interested in them either.

If people want a paper based thing then good, do one, Im not trying to get everyone to subscribe to my opinion, and you telling me to get out more only makes it more likely that this stubborn young fart will ahppily spend even more time indoors :)

[visualove]

What a great thread! I think there is a place for a mass specialized print publication, that being said, starting it here with longer illustrated articles should be done. For a mass hard copy publication, we could take some inspiration (of what not to do) from res magazine which has been drifting in focus from indy filmmaking to music to gaming and Wired magazine which rode the .ain't-it-cool boom to blandness and lack of cred under Conde Nast. I don't think ads supporting a print or print/dvd magazine are bad - of course they have to be good ads...

I just saw the new e-books by Sony and Panasonic, they are Japan only and store the content on SD memory cards. Complicating things, there are several competing e-book storage formats. The demo showed manga comics, black and white, using electronic paper - super low power and sunlight readable - perfect for reading on the tube. So it is just a matter of time.

[neoteo]

mag+dvd

i would love to have a vj mag to read in the toilet

with the best of vjc & vjf , images , articles , hardware reviews , software reviews , cool stuff , gigs , video clips , tuturials , pub , future technoligy , old shcool video and film , japan.

even some posts or threads . makes it more human

good design , good photos

10 $ us

i know so many people that buy mags about sutff they never did or want to do , they buy it just to be up dated , with whats going on in the world ...

a vj mag , to me sounds like a gold mine .... go for it

[VJOZ]

Hey Y'all,

Just my 2 bits for the thread.

We went through this discussion back when we first started VJTV. We figured that a grassroots series was the best way to start promoting VJs to the bigger markets. Recently, with our jump to airing online, our viewership has grown, but it's still mostly VJs who tune in.

There's some other big changes in the works as well. We have plans of getting VJ aired on a mid-level cable network by 2005. It totally been up to the VJ community to make this happen. Not directly ? it's more about having enough original quality content for VJTV to jump from "growing concern" to "going concern" in commercial entertainment.

IMHO it's way too early to create a successful VJ-based print magazine, but with the VJ book coming out at the end of the year, and other projects, we're getting closer and closer.

-VJOZ

[Esotic]

Hey VJOZ!

Is there any way to get ahold of high (DVD MPG2) quality copies of the VJ TV episodes?

Maybe like making them available on the VJ Art Direct Connect HUB.

Cheers,

-Esotic

[pseiko]

Originally posted by neoteo
i would love to have a vj mag to read in the toilet

yes!!!

[bassy]

I've read here some good and interseting things.

I'm first of all wondering why so many people specially want it for the "video-content" reason. Wich you in fact can find easy on the net. If you do not sell by ordinary book shops, paper shops, the chances to grow are minimal. (some friends of you who read it, someone online who found this, but 'ordinary' club life people waiting in the shop, accidentally seeing this and 'want to try it for once won't get in touch') I assume costs to publish it are way to high for only 1000 copies (if we would get so far). So the best (certainly to start with) is a purely digital version, distributed by the internet. It would be made that way that it's printable and looks the same like an 'ordinary' mag.
--for this part everybody now agree (almost) I guess

For publishing I tought about this idea.
Exhale is building a new version of VJC but he has a cash flow problem. So by leaving VJC for free to all members, but asking money for the mag, to be able to read-download - find the links to sponsors, gigs, 'exclusif bonus video material' this could be solving 2 problems at the same time.
If some people are 'responsible' for layout, cover work,... and some others, who can write a bit, contribute a few articles every x months, readable like a mag (not plain text), coloms, pictures etc. I guess this could be a good and cheap way to start it, and if it grows (what we all hope) we still can consider about CD/DVD versions, paper version, combo versions to distribute.

A few of the possible parts after me could be:
-artist review/artist of the month -software review/preview + interview with the programmers. -hardware realted articles -How to .... in 5 editions (wich makes people to buy the four next ones) - tutoritorials+used files
If nobodies wants to make money with this, it has a chance to survive, it would only cost you some spare time

[alangeering]

whatever format it comes in, I'm willing to write a minimum of 1 article every 2 months (though possibly more). My experience is only theatrical AV and hardware stuff, so I could only write on a limited number of (relevent) subjects.

The questions still remain about the producers and the consumers. Who are they?

The only way I can see this thing going comercially is if we can get noticed by a club/DJ mag and sell them content (at a price that's attractive to them). We would have to garuentee them quality atricles - but who can provide them?

We already have at least one person amongst us who writes for a DJ magazine. The question is, is there a DJ or club magazine that would want to host a significant number of pages of content.

Of if not a DJ Mag, then who else? There are a few art magazines out there, but whether they would be accepting of VJ talk I have no idea.

Or we just stick to the web + file sharing for tutorial files.

Alan

[bassy]

Originally posted by alangeering
The questions still remain about the producers and the consumers. Who are they?

Or we just stick to the web + file sharing for tutorial files.

Alan
After me for now, the producers are some skilled people of the VJC/F comunity the consumers are members who want to read articles (wich in fact is different from forum talk) and get acces to exclusive content related to the articles (not only tutorial files).

[eXhale]

there is no division between consumers and producers here.

[seex]

making a magazine for ourself, is not promoting vj culture to a wider circle of interesents. Leting the world know what we do shuld be one of the goals of the magazine, promoting exelence is also on my list.

[alangeering]

Exams and interviews today, way to tired to write properly.

Here are some of my thoughts:
When the new VJC Scripts come along then we should all make an effort to help launch with as much useful content as possible. This is where all good articles should be anyway. I'm sure there will be a digest of recent articles, that will read something like a magazine.

If we want to go further, then we have to be very sure of our market.

Is it VJC/VJF readers?
Is it anyone who is interested in visuals?
Is it people who are interested in general club topics (DJ, etc.)?
Is it people who are involved in the visual arts?
Is it a combination?

The approach we would have to take to go for any one of these groups would be different from the rest. So who is it?

[djnada]

I guess I'm in the league of "old." 46 years young, to be precise. I dig the electronic format. Many times I simply print out. PDF is a great format that can be emailed, as well. I hark from the NYC East Village scene in the 80s. Alot of people were doing some very cool 'zines, such as Between C & D, RedTape, and World War III Illustrated. WWIII was picked up by, I think, Semiotext, the Columbia University associated press. point is, none of these really lasted or made money, yet they were very, very cool mags of their time. Don't get me wrong - I read Remix and DV magazines regularly. Future Music is good, but not easily available in the states. Perhaps a section in an established cutting edge periodical like this, with vj content on the enclosed cd or dvd and links to this and other websites embedded into the cd/dvd would be a step toward a sort of multipronged publication, without the hassle of overhead? It would just be ashame to invest alot of time and money into a project that may not work. Meanwhile, this site does already have a good deal of great content. Content is King, no matter what the format! When you factor in links to movie content, the combination is incredible. Also the personal aspect, where individuals can post ideas, comments and samples of work is highly democratizing and cannot be done in magazine format. Again, I love color glossy mags, but perhaps this VJ site would profit better by riding the wave of this relatively new form of communication. :alien: - Just some transient thought waves from the amorphous grey matter! -Nada DJ

[eXhale]

based on comments here, i'll implement a way to make featured articles which will appear on the homepage. hope this will give an intensive to write more quality articles. i also plan to include an (optional) author's bio on articles pages.

[holly]

Thanks eX!
:)

[Lucidhouse]

thanks eXhale
and thanks to all the ideas and offers

I didn't put an ezine on poll, thinking VJcentral played that role pretty well already though it lacks design/graphics etc...getting funding from subscriptions for an ezine is problematic, usually it's the adds that pay. ( but an ezine could be great, got to entice peeps with extra goodies like downloadable loops etc.)

It is a matter of time before there is a VJ mag...(in fact I won't be surprised if there's one being edited right now) I think the fact that some giants like bmw and motorola are jumping onto the bandwagon is proof enough. Advertising is the main revenue for most magazines and I think there will be willing brands.
It is a big undertaking, but definitely something that could be planned and edited by an online community...mainly it's peoples time and talents that are needed.

Looking at the poll votes so far, it's leaning towards a small glossy booklet with DVD...

anyways here's a collection of gathered from ideas on the forum and also how I would like to see it.

*why? The VJ artform needs to grow up now, stand up and be counted, show the music industry we're a serious bunch that can contribute immensely to the industry, dispel the bad reputation some vjaying has by showcasing shit hot work..Vj'ing is in dire need of some biging up! Look at how far DJ's have got by biging themselves (ego and all) theres even a song now claiming that GOD is a DJ!
(a form business card to the music industry, and related lifestyle brands)

* who's the readers? I would say, established and wanabee VJ's, people interested in audio visuals, clubbers and festival goers, art students, musicians, dj's, promoters, performers, DVD collectors, ...

* what content would it have?
+_ 24 page glossy booklet with DVD inside

:Booklet (pocket mag)
>the history of
>Reviews on hardware, software, DVD albums
>editorials on movers and shakers in the scene
>interesting projects, galleries, public spaces etc;
>reviews on audio visual friendly clubs and festivals
>VJ profiles covering the globe.
>articles on why DJ's need VJ's so badly (big'ing up)

DVD
:45 minute audio visual mix by guest dj's and VJ's (collectable shit)
:unique royalty free visual loops
:short clips, show cases and god forbid some corporate sponsored mixes...
:club, festival performances/documentaries
:software trial versions.
:freeware

:the Business side
:first get the advertising to cover costs
:limited editions and collectable price point
:stocked at specialist book stores, galleries, sold through VJcentral and subscriptions
:profits back into another publication and into upkeep of vjcentral...and maybe pay some of the crew that become regular mag staff.

anyways, this is a brief outline...I'm sure theres lot's more ideas

I've put in some time, and had a bit of fun, maybe we could get a thread/folder on the forum to organise it all ...it might even take 6 months to complete, it could fizle out or it could become a reality... ?

Heres is a pic of a quirky cover design I've done...didn't want it to be to obvious (cameras projectors etc..) , bit of grittiness , video noise, distressed cheeky vj baby, and "Vee jay" instead of VJ cause I think it's more catchy and flows better...

[Rovastar]

I like your plan.

I feel if there is something to get hold of it will benifit more. Everything is online now-a-days but computer magazines , etc still sell despite online presene even geek hacking (well used to be) magazine like the quaterly 2600 sell.

It all depends on the initail adverting interest. but if you are serious I am sure it could happen. We have already had VJC interest from one of teh big 4 record labels so I don't we why we cannot spread the net wider.

[Kyle]

Nice work:yep: What are the opinions for start-up costs? Say advertising doesn?t pay as well as you would have liked, how much are you talking about?

The design is nice but the text needs some work. I am having trouble reading some letters that are blended by the black background. Maybe a glow could fix that up. I don?t really read dj mags, used to but not anymore, but If I saw this on the rack I would grab it. Happily drop 10 euros for it. Cause it?s got the DVD. :D What would the cover price be?

[MindMimic]

There definitely is a need for a VJ mag right now, not only b/c VJs as a whole would find it interesting but the opportunity right now is ripe for something like this.
There are millions of magazines out there right now, none aimed at VJing...NONE... Thats a hedge up...to be the first. Content is key. I came on this site b/c I am into clubs, my knowledge base is sound reinforcement and lighting, DMX, ect. However, I truly believe that VJing is the next step as we head into this new century. Lets face it...People here are doing some great stuff. Half of you guys are your own innovators. Its amazing some of the things and ideas I've seen on this site. As a club owner I would no doubt subscribe to the needs of a VJ and orient a club with their needs, if not base the club around VJing.
Don't sell yourselfs short, thats the problem most people make. A VJ magazine could be just as good or better as any other magazine out there. Its the people behind the scenes that make the creative magic for a magazine to work. Working together, we could all see some benefits from this.

What Does a DJ mag or anyother mag have that ours wouldn't? What would make their mag so much more interesting?

Is VJing not interesting? What made you start VJing? If you can inject your insperation into a magazine, you can start to build a base. The single biggest problem I've seen with magazine startups is they put everything into the first issue expecting it to sell when really you end up giving the magazine away for several issues

I think the best thing would be to tie a VJ magazine in with music, clubs, computer graphics...and that all necessary ingredient "Pop Culture". But I am no expert in this, but Im smart enough to know that there are experts out there that know about this kind of this stuff.

First thing is to Verify the need for a VJ magazine. I personally feel it is there. And a VJ magazine could be just as good and appealing as any DJ magazine out there. But experience shows that the top flaw in a start-up effort is an insufficient demand for the publication. The potential readers didn't have a need for it; neither did the potential advertisers.

So how do you avoid this? An experienced research or consulting firm can offer a range of services to help. They can test the validity of a publication concept and give a professional and objective reaction, highlighting the strengths and weaknesses of your idea.

Also a solid business plan would be needed. The realities of this are immense. But the pay off would be huge, not only for those involved but the VJ community as a whole. I think the best way is to take the professional route on this and get in touch with some professional in the publication field. Which I will be doing.

I also think a great effort should be made to spread the wealth on this if it happens. Keep it grassroots, so when it does take off, we can remember where this started. I also think VJs should remember that what they are doing is paving the way for something new and great...if you don't feel that way, then you've already lost.

Comments are apreciated Mobbin01@hotmail.com

[Anyone]

It's going to be difficult to have any kind of object based periodical for VJing,
the audience (VJs) is there,
but simply too spead out in different areas of the world,
in each specific area, the number of consumers
will be too small for any magazine shop to dedicate shelf space to.

in the end the biggest killer for such an endeavour
is still distribution costs, again because too few consumers
are spread out too thin all over the globe...

although electronic versions of a such specialised magazine
may be more appropriate financially,
I do much prefer objects myself sometimes...
besides, would an electronic version be much different
to VJCentral's article based system?

at the moment, what VJ Scan is doing (DJ Mag's VJ section)
is standing on the shoulders of a bigger giant, DJing.
its a bit like being a tennant, before being able to own a house ;)

I'm sure there's a lot more magazine in the world
that would welcome being approached to do a section on VJing,
be it magazines about DJing, lighting, tech toys design or geek culture.
anyhoo, it's a step in the right direction ...

It think it will definitely be a step-by-step situation
before seeing a monthly magazine on VJing
we'll see quaterly editions on the subject,
and before that, we'll see maybe "almanac" type "review of 2007" books
and before that dedicated one time books,
like the one D-Fuse are in process of doing

in each step of the way to seeing regular monthly magazines on VJing appear
market people are doing research to see if it will be possible to proceed to the next step,
and if the present step is not doing well financially,
they're not going to go forward.

so this may sound ridiculous,
but our role is partly also to prove that there IS a market,
and how we can do that is to be consumers,
so when books are coming out about VJing,
please go out and buy them,
othewise we'll never move up to a magazine type situation...

Ne1

PS: VeeJay was the name of a 60's label that the Beatles were under...

[Kyle]

Does anyone recognize this man?

http://images.colorkinetics.com/people/images/georgeheadshot.jpg

NO?

Color Kinetics (http://colorkinetics.com/corp/people/executives/) says he?s George Mueller the CHAIRMAN & CEO of Color Kinetics. What does this have to do with a VJ magazine thread. Well, maybe it?s stupid but I was looking for potential web addresses for the future vj magazine. Go figure vjmag.com and vjmagazine.com are both taken under this gentlemans name. Is this guy starting the next VJ magazine? Competition looks tough. Especially with an inventor of LED equipment and displays. How do we compete with a corp. of this magnitude?

[Anyone]

Originally posted by DmT


http://images.colorkinetics.com/people/images/georgeheadshot.jpg
How do we compete with a corp. of this magnitude?

We don't compete, we collaborate...
if he has the domains for VJmag.com or whatever,
he obviously wants this project to happen,
and he's got the means to support it...

what he's lacking though is talent and expertise in the VJ field,
and this is where we should come in,
this is how we should approach him,
we advise you, you support us...

Ne1

[fluchtpunkt]

vjmag.tv or vjmag.org both still seem to be free.

...better be quick ;)

[Lucidhouse]

veejaymag.com is free! should we get it????

[asterix]

I like vjmag.com and the whole george mueller idea.. interesting - expires end of this year. Perhaps worth a shot even to get some much needed FUNDING... whistle whistle...


By the way well done crew - I think an emags a bloody good alternative.

[Kyle]

Sure why not. It couldn?t hurt.

[Kyle]

I sent Mr. Mueller a email and I am waiting for a response.

[seex]

I thin a vj mag is a great idea, how to pull it off is probably a diferent story. As much as i dont like the ide i think ads are necassary, i have the glossy tipe in mind. A golssy magazine culd get the real big lables interested in our work and help speed up the production of dvds with music and visuals to go with it. This culd result in some clubs just playing this ang getting vj-s out of work, but thise kind of palces are usualy more about compromise than qality so i dont mind so much, besides this culd also show the diferece of live visuals as opposed to only a dvd beying played.

I think a resonably cheap idea is to promote a web site that wuld eventualy become a magazine. Promotion is what we culd do as vj-s. The idea is to create a serias of short clips that promote the url and distribute them to vj-s on this forum, if we play them long enough we culd get a much wider audience than just vj-s. when the website is known enough is shuld be much easyer to find ads and sponsors.

I think vj-centrl is a great name and domain, i dont konw about the interest for such a thing from the webmasters of VJC.

[littlecatalyst]

Originally posted by Anyone
We don't compete, we collaborate...
if he has the domains for VJmag.com or whatever,
he obviously wants this project to happen,
and he's got the means to support it...
what he's lacking though is talent and expertise in the VJ field,
and this is where we should come in,this is how we should approach him,we advise you, you support us...
Ne1

beautifully put ne1: someone get this man on the phone! (or maybe for now, we just get Ex to name the new magaziney-section something like Muellerskids...)

been out of the loop for a while and LOVE seeing ow this is shaping up. woo hoo!!

[littlecatalyst]

did ROVA say that a major lable wanted to buy VJC???? what? did i miss something?:confused:

[eXhale]

Originally posted by seex
I think vj-centrl is a great name and domain, i dont konw about the interest for such a thing from the webmasters of VJC. VJC is 100% open to anyone with good ideas and interested in putting work/energy into them, as opposed to just talking about them. i like the idea of a magazine but i'm kinda dissappointed to see that some people want to rush to create another website while VJC has been waiting for serious articles for months, but do as you wish anyway.

[littlecatalyst]

Ex--
are you into VJC becoming a magazine as well as the entity that we already know and love? if so thats amazing, i mean the name is great as is the 1000000% street cred (mr muller will prolly digit, and we already have some sort of demarchy here already so it could easily maintain our standards.....)


((can we have a cartoon strip in the back with stuff like weirdest things ever said to VJ material??)

[holly]

Lil'Cat, eX has been writing new code for VJc/f that sounds pretty amazing (it's over my head so I'll have to wait and see) but more media content should be a major deal! In another thread we were discussing WHAT would be good content for a magazine. There are some things that just don't translate to the web.... Web is best for immediate and ongoing dialog and info/research, but it isn't great for long prose or deep introspection. Most people just won't devote that much time to a single webpage. I don't think this is a problem with HTML, per se, just the perception of the web and the comfort conditions surrounding most people's computer stations (good for work and info, bad for relaxing and reading). I think that multi formats and media doesn't detract from the value of VJc. More is more. It doesn't divide the scene, it anchors it.

But I've subscribed to a few PDF magazines and I have to say it isn't really as good as an actual magazine that you can get comfortable with. Maybe they haven't been that well designed, but really I think it's just not the right format.... Could you imagine going to the cinema to get the nightly news? Seems weird today, but newsreels were big business at one time. Now with television it seems rediculous.... At the same time who would ever want to watch 2001 A SPACE ODYSSEY on the small screen....

I guess I'm not saying anything other than experiment. Use the formats at hand. Evolve, merge, differentiate, explore. Now everyone go home this week and put together a 500 - 1200 word article on VJing. Since there are so many impending VJ mags (online and off) content is still king!

[Kyle]

Originally posted by eXhale
i like the idea of a magazine but i'm kinda dissappointed to see that some people want to rush to create another website while VJC has been waiting for serious articles for months, but do as you wish anyway.

What do you mean by serious articles?

[alangeering]

What Ex is saying is that VJC already is a web resource for all things VJ and could be even greater if more people cared and added articles.

I'm guilty of not writing things up properly for VJC. I've done most of the work on a collected guide to video formats and video cable formats. This will go up sometime over summer.

The magazine is a great idea, but I would steer efforts away from a website that just re-invents VJC. The new VJC will have a good front page with "latest articles", "news", etc. and even cartoons if you really want them, (new code supports images). (BTW much of these features are already there).

I would definatly support people:
+ contributing more to VJC
+ going for a VJ mag in a "not-totally-web-form" (i.e. DVD, CD, mag, printable formatted PDF, etc.)

Alan

[Lara]

I've known a few people who've tried to put together magazines and they've failed miserably. Its such a difficult thing to do- a cutthroat market and with no experience the road is outrageously hard. I would really like a vj magazine but I think its got to be started by someone who really knows that game.

If people are interested and I'm repeating myself here- why not just provide the content here on vjc? I would really LOVE to read more journalistic style articles here. If that isn't an idea that appeals then perhaps you should question not whether we need a magazine at all but whether we actually have any content to sustain it- because it should be the content of this magazine that's important not the design.

[Amukidi]

Well - I've written a couple of "serious" articles here, but am sure that few people have actually read them! I got a little bit of feedback (no, I'm not looking for thanks / praise - just acknowledgement that the feature exists!!) - yet threads about hollywood actresses scantily disguised as serious discussion run for weeks! Maybe they shouldn't be tucked away in a corner, and we need an area that shares the high profile of the daily threads.
I really don't know - what I do know though, is that Lara is right - a VJ mag would be great, but VJs are the last people to actually produce it!! (they need to create the content - two different things).

[neoteo]

Originally posted by Amukidi
Well - I've written a couple of "serious" articles here, but am sure that few people have actually read them! I got a little bit of feedback (no, I'm not looking for thanks / praise - just acknowledgement that the feature exists!!) - yet threads about hollywood actresses scantily disguised as serious discussion run for weeks! Maybe they shouldn't be tucked away in a corner, and we need an area that shares the high profile of the daily threads.
I really don't know - what I do know though, is that Lara is right - a VJ mag would be great, but VJs are the last people to actually produce it!! (they need to create the content - two different things).


good point ... could it be most of members are not serious VJs ?

;)

i have never made a live show , ever ...

[holly]

No kidding....:rolleyes:

Where did you put the article Amukidi? On VJc or VJf? And did you give it a bit of an announcement here? Link please.

[Amukidi]

They were a while back now under "content creation" - kinda rest my case;)

[neoteo]

for most people its easyer to point something when its bad then when its good ...

ego

[Amukidi]

Neoteo - Maybe you should read the articles first before making any judgements...

[neoteo]

Originally posted by Amukidi
Neoteo - Maybe you should read the articles first before making any judgements...

i have read all the articles :confused:

[holly]

It might be nice if you are sympatico with one author if you could pull up any/all other articles written by that person.... It's clear there are various paths for VJs: PC, Mac, Hardware-only, AE, Resolume, DVD, etc. Once you find someone who has a similar method to yours you could sort of follow their advice into other areas (content creation, performance advice). Might be relevant.

[gnomatron]

hmm, I'm not convinced there's enough of a market for a VJ magazine; do any of the big DJ magazines carry a regular VJ section and occasional cover DVDs? That would surely be a better way to approach raising the profile of VJs.

[vjrei]

VJ Magazine... jmm...

What I see is that VJing goes 90% towards sharing information and is very fast and very technical. It would be like a magazine "for music lessons".

Imagine a magazine talking about musicians, techniques and their works. Usually magazines relies on new equipment advertising ¿how much can you say about new VJ equipment and software? There is not that volume.

I see books about VJing or probably "news" about VJing more realistic.

In such case you wouldn't be talking about a magazine format. It won't be like Keyboard magazine or Guitar Player.

I believe it should start towards news, some interviews and something like that,to catch the eye and the attention. Some sort of content I can keep and use as a reference for the future.

I believe that making interviews to Vjs regarding:
1. What equipment they use
2. What sort of content they create
3. What they want to transmit
4. How they create their content
5. How they market themselves

I believe there is a load of interesting information there and many people would keep that information as for reference.

"VJ news magazine" would be figure I would sugest.

[paranoidkarma]

I don't know if you guys noticed that this is a thread from 2004 :P
VAM - Visual Aesthetics Magazine
www.va-mag.net
www.va-mag.net/blog

Currently i'm expecting some articles and after i receive them i will put the first issue online.

[mowgli]

We're doing the green thing again. Let's recycle threads!

[paranoidkarma]

hahaha :D
or we are a bunch of Lara Crofts doing some tresure hunting here...
Or Indiana Jones (it sucks the new movie)

[Donnie Darko]

As far as I'm concerned VJ Central is and will be (when it returns) the greatest VJ resource.

[bleep]

^^^ that said....time can be of the essence...

probably easiest would be to join a mailing list to receive an online "magzineee" / PDF to a link with a well planned, interesting and update quarterly.


i think it could start as small as even just 6pages..


update a grow from there....DVD would be good as a membership incentive perhaps.

additionally you could make an annual hard copy of etc.....

i acquired a publication entitled - 've - "ja good example of some well produced and polished

[Mixed Ape]

How about a torrent? It solves the problems of hosting and bandwith and most Torrent Apps have support for RSS so you would never miss a show.

PDF along with a Creative Commons set of loops. Links to tutorials and interesting articles.

[paranoidkarma]

www.va-mag.net (http://www.va-mag.net) & www.va-mag.net/blog (http://www.va-mag.net/blog)

feel free to write us :)

vam@va-mag.net // vamdirector@gmail.com

[USE]

www.va-mag.net (http://www.va-mag.net) & www.va-mag.net/blog (http://www.va-mag.net/blog)

feel free to write us :)

vam@va-mag.net // vamdirector@gmail.com

am i missing something? like the content?

[vdmoKstaTi]

VAM is awesome... shh you :)

[evomedia]

am i missing something? like the content?
VAM is awesome... shh you

vdmoKstaTi He wasn't knocking the content lol, the sites don't work at all...

Both these links direct people to a parked domain, no content or website

Check for yourself www.va-mag.net & www.va-mag.net/blog

[MoRpH]

I've said it MANY times before I'd be more than happy to contribute my words and even a regular selection of my clips.

I think a Torrent is a great idea. With a PDF and loops/mixes/demo software in the one torrent, also might be worth knocking up and .ISO for ppl that want to DL it and knock out copies to give out locally.

[Kenny]

It would be good if there was some sort of magazine. It would be useful for new people getting interested. Im sure there will become more of a need in the future when more people get into VJing.

[epochapex]

I dunno if this has allready been posted, but here's a link to a current VJ magazine from Germany. It's written in English.

http://sceen.org

[Kyle]

It's not so current. It says 2007 for the last issue with a notice saying 2008 for the next issue. They are 2 years behind still. :P VJ collectors item.