Need feedback regarding VJC code change

[eXhale]

OK I have finally found a possible solution for the current problems with VJCentral. I want to post about it here (and not just on the editors forum) so that everyone can give their feedback. Here are the problems I'm talking about:

VJCentral badly needs new features and more functionalities. I feel that the lack of development of the website has been slowing down the evolution of the community, despite fantastic projects like AVIT.
The code of VJCentral is very much outdated, I wrote it about two years ago when I was just starting with PHP and now I feel that things could be done a lot better. Furthermore I feel that VJC could do with a redesign.
I have looked at many many other content management scripts and, while some are quite good, none of them fit my needs. Besides most of the features of VJC would require to write whole new modules.
At the moment I'm pretty much the only developer who can work on the code. Rovastar and robotfunk have much helped me but I'm still the only one who can really dig into the code as I wrote it. I was hoping to find more PHP developers as the site grew but I guess VJing is a pretty remote topic from PHP.
I have three other non-profit websites under development or redesign, all of which are very important for me. I don't give much time to them at the moment but it still takes time I could use for VJC.
I need to pay the bills. I can't dedicate all my time to non-profit projects or I'll be on the streets. It's already difficult for me to keep up with this side of thing.So, I've thought much (too much?) about all this and I've come to a possible solution: I will develop a full-on content-management script (CMS) with many new features, I will use it for my three other non-profit websites AND I'll sell licenses of this script in order to pay the bills.

Now I would love to keep the whole thing open-source, I know that this would be in the spirit of VJC and in fact open-sourcing is what I had promised. However there is just no way I can develop a full CMS by myself if I can't get anything back from it. Open-sourcing would really need a team of programmers and as I said we don't have this here.

There are several advantages to this solution:

The CMS will use a CSS-based template engine, it means that all the web designers here will be able to help if they want. CSS gives a lot of freedom regarding the design.
The CMS will be module-based, this means people with some PHP knowledge will be able to write new sections to VJC without having to touch to the core of the code. I'll setup a module repository with free access, only the core of the CMS and some essential modules will require a fee.
I'll be able to finish my other non-profit scripts without too much efforts.
I can get paid a bit for my efforts and the content and features of VJC will keep on being free. No changes for end users.The only disavantage I can think of, aside from the code not being 100% open-source, is that I'm taking risks by putting my energy into such a big project without knowing if I'll be able to sell licenses. But I'm pretty confident that if the script is what I'm thinking about, it will all work out fine.

So what do you think of this? If this solution is chosen I'm going to just finish a few things which need to be done and then I'll be able to focus most of my time to the development of the CMS. With a bit of hope it will all be online by early next year and VJC will finally be able to keep its initial promises.

[Rovastar]

I don't mind helping out. Although as late things have been getting on top of me and not been able to devote time towards dev stufff on VJC/F.

Hopefully soon but I have been saying that for a few months now......

[eXhale]

Originally posted by Rovastar
Hopefully soon but I have been saying that for a few months now...... Exactly ;)

[brain]

dear ex, thanks again for all the work you put into this, i'm sure the community and VJing itself wouldn't have evolved in this scale during the last year if there hadn't been the forum you created.

Originally posted by eXhale
VJCentral badly needs new features and more functionalities. I feel that the lack of development of the website has been slowing down the evolution of the community (...)


please consider new functions carefully. speaking of software, most program updates just lead to bloated code and lots of functions that are rarely needed but make things less easy to handle. vjforums is dead easy to use and it works on almost all machines with most browsers. that's great! please keep it simple and lean. if the community is slowed, it's NOT by missing functions, but for other non-forum related reasons.


Furthermore I feel that VJC could do with a redesign.

i think one main appeal of the forum is the plain and clean design. please keep it simple and free of all gimmicks and "interesting" design ideas. at least, if the css model is realized, make it possible to choose customized skins with the most simple and reduced design as a default. (besides i wouldn't miss the lavender color :) )

your
brain

[alangeering]

Sorry, can you clarfiy something for me. I've just read the above post and it talks about the forums (VJF), you talk about VJC.

Would you be updating:
1) VJC code
2) VJF code
3) All of it

Thanks for all the work,
Alan

[holly]

I have no programming skills, but you are a little inspecific on how these changes will improve VJC or in what ways the old code/lack of specific features has held back the site.... Obviously I don't want to burden you with a lengthy explaination and if you feel improvements are needed I fully support your decisions.

Not really being helpful here.:sad:

[eXhale]

I want to change the code of VJC, VJF is just fine, although for the CMS I'll probably include a phpBB module so it could be worth doing the transition (phpBB is more user-friendly than vBulletin and it's free). I also had the feeling brain was missunderstanding my post?

Holly, it's a matter of expansion. I can keep on patching up my old code but in the end it will require a major recoding. And have you noticed VJC has hardly changed over the past 18 months? There are tons of improvements I can think of... and I don't mean burdening the site with tons of useless features, in fact I would like to make it more user friendly. Anyway I can't give a list of features/changes yet as I still have to think about it.

[eirenah]

i guess the only way i can help is VJC redesign. and many others here i guess.
when i come up with some ideas i'll open a new thread where i can upload them, so as anyone else who have some ideas. people could give comments-critics-suggestions and when we all decide what we like the best we can just implement the similar colors/icons/typography/elements to PHBB (which i think is not a problem).

eX, just give us a deadline when you want all design ideas to be finished and posted here.

[brain]

ok i mixed up VJF and VJC, sorry! monday mornings... :rolleyes:

i referred to VJF, which is fine and seems to be contined without major changes, which is fine.

VJC may indeed be improved a little. maybe just open a thread with wishes and ideas by the users, and a second one with what you think is possible. people may discuss which features are useful, and which are not needed, and the work might be focussed on what most people want.

sorry i'm no pro with php, just the ol' css and html...

[wellREDman]

in essence x your proposing an overhaul of how vjc works "under the bonnet" to make subsequent updates etc. easier ?

gets my vote

[holly]

Would love to be able to insert a jpeg within the body of a text, even if that jpeg sits on another server.... Sometimes it's impossible to talk about visuals without showing an image. Diagrams are also sometimes necessary.

Still not really being helpful, but trying. :)

[oxygen]

maybe its an idea to make a kind of member-ship for vjc?
so a part of the money can go to development, etc and another part goes back to the members in an online catalogue or something??...
dunno, it's a common thing, but it probably works. ..

[eirenah]

..the idea of making VJC tshirts was...

1) all the money from tshirts, cups, bags... goes for VJC and VJF developing... (hosting, domain, eXhale's effort...)

2) preventing people to say things like 'can you play SystemOfADown please?' while you're gigging

now i'll go back to 1)
..as i see people are constantly saying that they would pay simbolic price for VJC/F evoultion if there was some kind of membership, yet only few people supported all this by buying a tshirt... so lets just take baby-steps. i think it's a fair deal. if someone wants to contribute to VJC finantialy, buy the tshirt. cmon people, they are not SO ugly ;)

i don't think eX will earn his first million with tshirts, maybe a few bucks, but at least he'll be able to cover some expences and he'll know that people really care. we're VJs, videoartists, if we can buy laptops, mixers, beamers, we can shure buy 1 tshirt and contribute to this 1squaremeter of cyberspace that means so much to us...

[oxygen]

well , a symbolic price obviously doesnt stimulate pple enough these days... if there is some kind of member-community, and pple can be part of that by fair payment it might be more convincing and stimulating to do so....

and..personally i'd rather see the money spent on other things than gadgets like teacups, or t-shirts..(..),
....but i know thats not an excuse.... :o

[eXhale]

well there has been not a single sale of tshirts yet and 90% of the money goes to cafeshops, so i don't expect to cover much expenses with this. there have been talks to setup some kind of premium membership which gives access to more features, something to think about during the re-coding.

honestly i don't know if it's a good idea. i don't want to restrict access to the site to members who can't pay but it's also hard to give a reason to give some money if there is nothing in return. maybe this premium membership could automatically be given to members who have reached a certain amount of VJC karma, thus pushing people to contribute more (another big problem with VJC) and allowing people who can't pay to still access to the premium features.

Originally posted by brain:
VJC may indeed be improved a little. maybe just open a thread with wishes and ideas by the users, and a second one with what you think is possible. people may discuss which features are useful, and which are not needed, and the work might be focussed on what most people want.yes, but it's still too early, the first major task will be a recoding of the backend. once this is done i can think about new features and will request suggestions and feedback.

regarding the redesign: i'll post here when you can start working on it. maybe the structure will be different from the current design, i don't know if i'll keep the top menus, even though i have no idea (yet) with what i could replace them.

cheers for the feedback :)

[sleepytom]

Originally posted by eXhale


maybe this premium membership could automatically be given to members who have reached a certain amount of VJC karma, thus pushing people to contribute more (another big problem with VJC) and allowing people who can't pay to still access to the premium features.


this is a very good idea :)

[eirenah]

...so if tshirts won't work then maybe banners could...
i think noone would mind few pixels of advertising, but VJ-related (software developers, copmanies that sell / produce computers/graphiccards/mixers/beamers/vj gadgets...) .. and i think also there will be people/companies that would be willing to pay...