drug use within the rave scean

[unjulation]

right this is a spin off from various threds posted at one time or outher within this forum such as:-

http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3717&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2482&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3037&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3037&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3100&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2977&highlight=drugs
http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=2676&highlight=drugs

(all these links end in drugs cos thats what i did a serch for)

and leading on from the "retro style" thred it seemed obvious that we as practitioners within this feild of work, ie rave, of one form or outher, (please understand that i use the term rave as a umbrela term to conver all aspects of the club/party/rave space) should look at what we are doiung and to coment upon it which in tern would/might lead us forward in our understanding of what we are doing and what we can do for the space as a whole in relation to the drug use/abuse of inderviduals within said space, and in tern what our influance is within said space

like we keep saying awareness, knowlage and understanding are the key

i dont know if i have to repeat what i have already said so far upon this subject? i wont at the moment but it might be usefull for the means of this topic, i'll leave that one for latter if this thred developes

but to continue what i was saying within the thred

http://www.vjforums.com/showthread.php?s=&threadid=3717

i find that this also conects with some basic aspects of life that i am constantly amazed by, that such basic principls of life have been interpretd by us in such complex ways, both indervidualy and socialy

to para-phrase holy life is more complicated then just sex and drugs

now i would surgest thats because we interprate these impulses within the mind set of psycho-biological beings within the 21st centuery and all that go's with that is why we see it as complex

leading on from this we then have to acept that within this world that we know and love it is complex per-say, but this can be simplified by understanding ware these impuses origanate from

its like saying "all i am doing is createing prety pictures for ravers" and yes i know that some of you out there disagre with that statement but to me no one has brought forward a good enough argument to the contrey

anyway i open it up to the floor to be shot down as you feel fit

[holly]

Ok. I'm not sure what you are trying to debate here Unj, but going by the title I'll ask if you think the visuals are more developed in cities where the drugs are more developed. If so, does the sophistication of the VJ scene evolve from the drugs (as in artists having access to mind-expanding drugs), or has the proliferation of parties drawn the drugs as well as the VJs?

Put another way, which came first: chicken or the egg?

[bluntfaktory]

i don't know if one has anything to do with the other , you might say the same thing about musicians , some do some don't , but i don't think it effects there creativity . i've seen plenty of people drop the plot when they loose control of their drug use . then there's others like President Bush , a collage cocaine user , and he did OK for himself . i wonder if there a connection there ? i'd say there's a bigger connection with VJing between the quality of music in a city , rather then the quality of the drugs . maybe i'm just naive in believing it's a music seine we are involved in instead of a another just a drug seine , however that does fly in the face governmental propaganda so who know i could be wrong .

[PilotX]

Originally posted by bluntfaktory
i however that does fly in the face governmental propaganda so who know i could be wrong .

anything that flies in the face of government propoganda is probably right ;)

I don't think you can seperate drugs, music and raves, they are all too interlinked, and I think now that visuals sit with them..

also Unj, i'm not entirley sure what you are arguing here.. are you wondering whether visuals can be more than just pretty pictures? (in which case, I don't understand what it has to do with drugs.. perhaps the cultural connection with hallucinogens and the acid party roots of visuals?) .. well vis can be more than pretty pictures, just as music can be more than pretty sounds.. but it depends on the environment, to bring a case in point, we have done CND benefits where the visuals have been there to provide a message that would be lost if there was just music - the visuals are considered an integral part of using the event to promote cnd's aims.. much more than pretty pictures (plus alot of the imagery is not pretty at all.. ).
you might be after the wider issue about what visuals means to the clubbing/raving culture, how it affects it.. well on a simple level visuals can be used to change physical spaces at clubs.. screen placement can open up or close down a space, perhaps if the fog walls become cheap enough they can even be used to create new walls and rooms in venues.. on the more ideational level of things, well that depends on each individual.. for some clubbers it is just pretty pictures to trip out on, for others it is an interesting new form of art, or an extra rythimn being added to the music..

[julez]

bluntfaktory, i agree with u to a certain extent but in a lot of cases drugs do effect the quality...i know that a lot of djs play when drunk or on drugs and perform some of the best sets ever recorded. Drugs are a part of the culture but most people don't come to take drugs. They come to have fun/dance/watch our visuals.

im still not sure what to think about the effects of visuals though:confused: :help: Maybe the topic for another philosophical debate?

[Lara]

Originally posted by bluntfaktory
i'd say there's a bigger connection with VJing between the quality of music in a city , rather then the quality of the drugs . .

I'm optomistically with Bluntfaktory here- the drug scene I think is tied up with visuals in the birth of the modern rave scene, along with much other social and economic change. I hate it when people make links between drugs and visuals so much, just because they both might be 'visual' doesn't mean they are necessarily very connected anymore. Most vjs I have met don't take their inspiration from drugs because they have seen it all before........

For me the influence of drugs is prominent in the work of avant-garde film which was the early foundation I think of visuals, think of Warhol, Burroughs, etc.... Although, the influence of ecstacy on the imager shown at raves is probably a fair point, and maybe the use of drugs in the birth of hip hop and sampling. It's much easier to be a musician off your face interfacing subconsciously with a musical instrument, than to be a vj lugging, plugging and crashing everything........ and then having to drive the van home!

[InsideUsAll]

on the topic of drug use within the scene, i personally think if it wasn't for drugs there wouldn't be a scene as it stands now. I like drugs of many flavours, but they don't represent a huge part of my life, moreover i like to use them to my advantage as apose to them using me to their advantage ;) but i think the rave/club scene exists as is because people like to go out and loose control, we are controlled everyday of our life by money, government, culture, peers etc etc when on drugs that feeling of control begins to be lost. I think thats what people seek when they go out to a proper party, the music the visuals, the people are all just the wallpaper to the punter going out and playing with the fine line of loosing control. depending on your personality we all like to experiment with that loss of control at different levels. i personally choose to not delve as deep as others [unless its a special occasion ;)]

the parties i go to may well differ considerably to the parties others here attend so my experiences may well be very different to others of course.

i've recently been reading a report of a huge psy trance party on a greek island 'samothraki'. this is one of the biggest events world wide in the psy trance calender. this year the police conducted a huge drugs bust. I've heard that 200 people were arrested. this is monumentally bad for this party. people go there essentially to do 2 things, take drugs & dance. if there was no music there next year then obviously very few people would attend, but my feeling is that if there are going to be no drugs there next year, then also very few people will attend. its a crying shame that an event as beautiful as this one will really struggle now because of the reputation english & other western tourists have earnt themselves recently on other near by islands, the greek authorities have obviously decided that they don't want their beautiful location & heritage to head in the direction of ibiza. I personally feel psy trance parties would not take the place in the same direction, but thats probably because I love the music and the scene, and not because i have a valid objective opinion on the subject.

anyway i fancied a rant on the subject, and i wasn't sure what point you were making either unj ;)

[Rovastar]

hehe

I was goign to do a similair thread myself.

But mine what have been along the lines of VJ's taking drugs.

Imagine people how different & peaceful glastonbury would have been this year if there where no coke or mushrooms around for teh VJ's to take. :);):D

You know who you are. :);):D :lol:

(I so need to get that evil devil similie back. :) )

[Lara]

.... and the girly smilie

[InsideUsAll]

my reputation preceeds me.

- special occasion!

[Amukidi]

Mmmmm....where do I start? Definitely one of those impossible chicken/egg scenarios - but I'd be fascinated to know what proportion of punters left the "average" club night/festival with clean blood! We must also determine whether or not we include alcohol in this discussion (Personally, I think we'd be stupid not to). Its my perception that class 'A's, are still extremely popular and very widely used. At the last few gigs I've done, I always get offered a pill from some geezer who has a baggy full of them. I frequently get offered them by punters - some of whom I've only just met, and I look old enough to be most of the punter's dad! acid and mushrooms seem to be making a big comeback as well - every town has a "head shop" that has incurred the wrath of their local paper by selling those mushroom kits. What am I saying here? That drugs are still a major element of people's night out. (Just in case some bozo was gonna say that they're not as prevalent these days). I have noticed a high proportion of clubs that do try to address this - even making sure that toilets are "covered" by CCTV, but the truth is, when you get to a festival, where police presence etc is minimal (i.e. wher folks are confident that they will get away with it) from what I can see, folks go a bit mad!
So as an observer (and participant - but just ganja for the last 20 years) I've noticed a dramatic increase over the last 30 years. As to the question of affecting creativity - well that debate will run on and on, partly due to the fact that many drug users really don't want to hear that their drug of choice just might be restricting them.
Let me explain that point before anyone jumps down my throat! It is well known that THC has a marked effect on one's visual and aural perception - no-one would deny that. However, I'm sure that you've all experienced the scenario when you write something, say something hear something or draw something when heavily under the influence, that seems at the time to be profound or amazing. In the cold light of day, this can sometimes be a real disappointment or even worse, utter bollocks! This is certainly true with alcohol and weed. Sometimes, of course, it was profound, and it was the heightened awareness that helped you access this. See the dilemna? It can work both ways and therefore cannot be entirely relied upon. How many folks have you had to listen to spouting utter shite whilst pilled up to the eyeballs? I must admit that, personally I tend to avoid rolling a fat one if I'm going to work now, chosing to save it till the work is finished, then watch it straight, followed by watching it munted! Call me anally retentive, but I save an awfull lot of time this way, create less work, but most of it ends up in the mix, with far less shit binned at the end!

One of my yardsticks as to the success of a clip (or series of clips) is how well it stands up to being watched a 9 in the morning! The theory being that if it looks great then, it'll look great anytime!!
God - I've just seen ths size of this - sorry - maybe I should delrte it...fuck it...

[robotfunk]

I agree that using drugs doesn't really help the quality of your work ... noticed this first making music ...

on cannabis you get some great ideas, but lose the motivation to actually realize them, and lack the long term memory to realize them later .... on e everything is beautiful ... dont ever go record shopping on e, you'll hate what you buy later ...

actually I once made something truely special, one of my best rhythm patterns ever, coming down from psychedelics ... but they are a bit too heavy for me to perform under the influence ... some ppl seem better skilled at that ... i remember a dj friend in london who couldnt even talk anymore from liquid acid, but did a blinding set on 3 decks in the main room of the end that blew everybody away ... erm respect to that ... usually my frustration with psychedelics is that you understand everything about the universe when you are on them, but its paradoxically impossible to take that info into the real world ... start to talk about it and find yourself unable to finish your sentence, try to write it down and it evaporates ...

it can be hard to get through a long night without any help from a friend ... but I feel really unprofessional if I get wasted when working , yes it has happened ...

[Amukidi]

"on cannabis you get some great ideas, but lose the motivation to actually realize them, and lack the long term memory to realize them later .... "

Yep - I had it in my mind to say something similar - just thought I'd gone on a bit! As for getting through the night - too true, I've spent many a night being the only one on water! Hard work, but worth it the next morning when everyone else begins their 4 days of being a "bit down"
I know a DJ who was hoiked out of a club, for lighting up a spliff, only minutes before he was meant to start! He did finally persuade the bouncer to let him in, but he did feel a twat!

[wellREDman]

i like to gig on a minimal amount of the three directions clubbers are being taken chemically,

a very light spliff (known derisively by my crew members as a "spicy cigarette")
a mild stimulant such as guarana
a pint or so of alchohol.

studio work tho i'm with amakudi
"do it straight then watch it munted "

and yeah jilt i know what you mean about feeling really unprofesional about accidentally performing whilst wasted

[Amukidi]

Truth be known Red, that usually ends up what I do - although I must admit the beer gives me a headache these days, never tried that guarana stuff tho - wassit like?

[brain]

yes from all my experience (my own and what i've seen on others) drugs definetely don't make anyone more creative. brilliant people may still be brilliant when high and do amazing stuff DESPITE the drugs but never BECAUSE of them.

maybe sometimes people are simply more relaxed when high, and this allows a better flow. this should be no reason to take drugs, but to learn to relax without them...

for the audience: pot smokers or people on psychedelics seem to be attracted by visuals, which is easily understandable.

poeple on speed or coke care much less for visuals, but if they do they may get into some theories and talktalktalk about them...

people on extasy are a different case - most of the times the visuals do not matter, they simply don't watch screens but want to have eye contact with the real lovely people around them.

but in general, visuals can hugely influence the "setting" of the drug users - lately a girl told me the night before clubbing on e she was really distracted and downed by the visuals of the vj which contained some agressive, destructive content and aesthetics. for this reason i always try to create a "visually safe" environment when playing, if it is a club or party context where people come to relax and have a good time. it's some sort of responsibility you have, even if it SEEMS like noone is watching :)

[brain]

oh i forgot to mention that a recreational use of drugs is ok to me (moderately even when performing) but the "creativity" thing is just a myth :rolleyes:

[Lara]

Originally posted by brain
lately a girl told me the night before clubbing on e she was really distracted and downed by the visuals of the vj which contained some agressive, destructive content and aesthetics. for this reason i always try to create a "visually safe" environment when playing

Yeah, that is so true, the first time I did visuals the brief from the promoter was "post-apocalyptic urban decay with giant insects". That was destroying a few minds so the next brief he gave me was one word: 'fluffy'! Much better imho, together with the dj, the vj has the m/punters mind control, you can't be abusing it. Dark hardcore beats are a lot easy to handle than dark realworld imagery, so if going dark maybe go abstract.

In terms of performing, I used to drink a load of booze when I played, but now I am a somewhat reformed character (ahem!) after that accidentally getting wasted and playing shite thing which was discussed earlier. :)

[Amukidi]

God - I dread the day when a promoter gives me a "theme" - I rather suspect I'd pass the job on!!!!!!!!!!! (anybody who's seen my work would understand!). Or maybe I'd have to drop a tab ;-D

[wellREDman]

Originally posted by Amukidi
Truth be known Red, that usually ends up what I do - although I must admit the beer gives me a headache these days, never tried that guarana stuff tho - wassit like?


guarana rocks, if you get on with it, which i think is only about a quarter of ppl.

it gives you all the energy of a good snort of charlie/whizz but without the arrogance/intensity. and the day after youll just be tired rather than the fluey comedown of other stimulants.

try it first in a non imortant situation tho as some ppl get either very twitchy a la high dose caffiene or some get no effect at all.
do bear in mind that it is still a stimulant causing yr body to act like you have alot more calories available to burn than you actually do, so eat well before, and drink lots of water.

[wellREDman]

Originally posted by Amukidi
God - I dread the day when a promoter gives me a "theme" - I rather suspect I'd pass the job on!!!!!!!!!!! (anybody who's seen my work would understand!). Or maybe I'd have to drop a tab ;-D

naw mate totally beg to disagree, theres no more of a challenge than being given a difficult starting place for a project,
ive done some really nice themed do's

we did an ibiza themed party once, where we did the chill room as well,
we put 2 beamers screens in there with a cgi beach scene, just waves lapping at the shore, that over the space of 12 hours turned from night thru sunup to day, at the same time we had a giant paper lantern in one corner that rose the height of the rioom from sunup, whilst we slowly turned off the fairy lights wed covered the ceiling with and raised the levels of the house lights
it was magic :)

[Amukidi]

For sure mate - what I mean is I don't tend to use figurative imagery in my work - just elements (mostly water) and the occasional bird, the rest is shapes - be tricky to cover "post-apocalyptic urban decay with giant insects" with circles and floating rectangles!!
You Brighton based yes? Am doing a gig at "Concorde 2" in early October - make sure we hook up - will put you on guest etc. Can't give details yet, but will keep ya posted!

[Anyone]

when low on drug contacts,
try the folowing combination

2 coffees 3 mars bars and a good wank

you can get creative and work for hours with that buzz...

ne1
:nod:

[Amukidi]

"2 coffees 3 mars bars and a good wank

you can get creative and work for hours with that buzz..."

Newbies- you read it here first ;-D

[Lara]

Originally posted by Anyone

2 coffees 3 mars bars and a good wank


Bwa ha ha NE1 :up:

I like getting a brief from promoters, but then I think of visuals as design- a bit of live problem solving.... you get a lot more space in visuals than in any area of established design, that's partly why its so good.

[wellREDman]

Originally posted by Amukidi
be tricky to cover "post-apocalyptic urban decay with giant insects" with circles and floating rectangles!!


is that a challenge ?

[i]You Brighton based yes? Am doing a gig at "Concorde 2" in early October - make sure we hook up - will put you on guest etc. Can't give details yet, but will keep ya posted! [/B]

yeah that'd be cool, just give us as much notice as possible, although im brighton based i live about ten miles into the bush (where public transport dont go at night) so have to make special travel arrangements :)

[wellREDman]

Originally posted by Anyone
2 coffees 3 mars bars and a good wank

you can get creative and work for hours with that buzz...



thats what i have for breakfast every day

[LEVLHED]

yeah right..you brits don't drink coffee!!!

[agsystems]

yea right and we dont wank either



hmm wank visuals.....

maybe not

[Bearings]

What really niggles me is when people, (whether it be people who are in touch with the music scene or not) seem to find it acceptable to label the "rave" scene or dance music scene as the drug boshing, crime inducing trouble makers.

Hello. Did you ever see the Stones in any of their states??? Not to mention Quo's binges on the white stuff. Oh, but they are respected pillars of the global community.

Music goes with the drugs and vice versa, whether it be dance, hip-hop, soul, rock and roll, jazz, and even classical.

Same type of arguement with the stereo typical drug crazed youths of today. All ages take them, when will people realise or accept this rather than laying blame with the easier targets!!!

I used to know someone who worked in a petrol station. The government would be amazed at the ages and types of people who buy 10 Bensons and a pack of King size rizla!!!!

It's the media that cause of lot of the bad associations with the rave scene. Installing their views into the everyday Joe without letting them think for themselves.

Having said all that.

The media does accept these associations on a account of festivals such as Glastonbury, Creamfields and the like, but only with a stricly no drugs policy. After all they can't be seen to condone the use of illegal substances. Unfortunately there is too much money to be made, for them to not get involved.

Now watchinhg TV you can see the influences that drugs and music have had on society by the types of VT edited together to advertise programs, football matchs, films and even kids programs!!

You can't ignore that drugs and music and a permanent resident of society today.

Now my dummy has been thrown clear of the pram! :)

Visuals in clubs and music events are here to stay. They are becoming an ever increasing important part of a show.

Trying to focus on Eminem on a stage with 200,000 people in front of you is hard, visuals help soothe the eyes and make them work much more fluidly.

Some people think visuals are important and others arn't really bothered. I think though that if they were not there, people would def notice.

Before we started using visuals at our events, they were good nights with excellent atmosphere, etc, etc. But it wasn't untill we added a wall of moving colour and images that the club seemed to come to life that little bit more. Kind of like lights but with an air of intelligence.

The media exposure that special FX have in movies, has also placed much more of an emphasis on the visual side of things. Perhaps making people realise that it is not just music that sets the scene. Something that has only been evident to the trained eye, (i.e. production crew of a film, music video or tv program) untill very recent years.

Done.

:)

[julez]

couldnt agree with u more bearings...media association came with the publicity generated by the government and then people heard and decided they could get munted. Back to the chicken/egg thing. Stupid media ruins everything for us.

Originally posted by LEVLHED
yeah right..you brits don't drink coffee!!!
haha...i work in a cafe during the day and trust me, there are some crazy british coffee drinkers. But most of the brit tourists just order tea:P

Poor bastards u r!!:D

[Lara]

Originally posted by Bearings
with an air of intelligence.


Woo hoo Bearings, great post! I'm going to tell promoters I'm "adding an air of intelligence" to their club now :)

You're so right anout media portrayals of the club scene, and your point about the vfx/perceptions of the viewer. Do you think that our audiences are becoming more visually aware? I think so, the influence of experimental film on TV styles has been great- even though it was absorbed into mainstream culture I think people have been really influenced by it. Look at programmes like 24 where the split screen is used to full effect ......... bring on vj culture!

[unjulation]

been away for just one day and this thred got so meny responses which to me shows that it is something worth discusing, basicly i had no real intention about what i was talking about it just seemd a relevant topic to discus after the "josha" thred and one that hadn't realy been takeled head on about the use of drugs within the sceen as a whole, i was interestd in what would come out, wether peeps would discus there own perceptions of drug use or talk on a wider stage of the sceen it's self which were both my intentions by discusing it, because i i'm constantly thinking about my own drug use within the space wether that be a punter or as a vj, if i go out as a punter/munter i like to get prety wasted but if i'm working then i tone that down to some alchole and splif and maybe some stimulates if i'm tierd and have done a gig the night before, mind i'm geting back into expresos at the moment and as i havent done coffee for about 5 years then i aint got any tolarance to it what-so-ever which is nice
but going back to the origional idea it was just to open up the debate wether that be drugs within the rave sceen it's self or even wider within scociaty as a whole
i would agree with Amukidi on the fact that you should always look at your work in the cold light of day when straight, i've done meny a gig when both i and the crowd have thought that the visuals were grate but when i then look at the output tape that i have done it's not that hot, whats interesting to me then is that the perception changes with set and seting and whatever drug has been taken, alchole, dope, coke, speed, acid, or e, but then the question arises of if it looked good on the night its self and the punters agree and later it doesn't does that mean it has no merit at all for sureley it's what you do on the night its self and the crowds responce to that that actualy maters
this leeds on to the fact as i see it is that the experiance of the night is a trancetry thing and should not neseserily be pined down as long as the people there liked what was going on at that point in time then thats the important thing-this i think touches upon the whole artist perception thing, which as you know i dont sercribe to, for an artist would whant there work to have some kind of permanance within sociaty, somthing that can be looked at at a later date and still have relevance, but to me what is important is the night it's self

[Amukidi]

Your last point is a good one unj - the moment being the important thing, but not all fine-artists crave the permanence thing, some do accept the transient nature of a concept.
Mind enhancing or state altering drugs have been with us since the year dot - its just in the last few hundred years that ordinary folks (not just the shaman or medicine man) have been given (or have taken) access to them. I smoked my first reefer in 1969 and have watched, in fascination, the whole "lets get wasted" culture grow and prosper! My daughters are now of the age where I was in 1969 and I expect nothing more or less from them. What scares me SO much more is the alcohol culture they are mixing with - I'd far rather they had the odd toke than partook in the binge drinking that a lot of their peers do. I'd also not feel wholly safe playing to a huge audience where alcohol was the only high available (images of "Blues Brothers" chicken wire across the stage. We are a very addictive race and will continue to be so until the second coming (only joking!) Half this media, which professes to judge different cultures spend a lot of time with bellies full of booze or noses stuffed with Bolivian marching powder, and most of the time talking shite! I'd not waste a second of your time giving a flying fuck what the media say - listen to your audience and your peers.

[LEVLHED]

Originally posted by Amukidi
I'd also not feel wholly safe playing to a huge audience where alcohol was the only high available (images of "Blues Brothers" chicken wire across the stage.

then don't EVER take a gig in Wisconsin :eek:

[funkcutter]

i thought that was the answer to 'what do you do whilst rendering'....

[k8eepants]

i like my head to be where the crowd's is, but thats a personal choice, not a mantra.....i totally respect anyone who can do it straight, but i'm an old lady and need enducement to keep up a 9 hour set and then do a getout!....as an "artist", i can do it straight, i can do it wankered......and i can enjoy it either way.....as crew i need a wakener or i'm grumpy as hell.i've not met any crew who do the job entirely straight , but as a non drinker, i am amazed that anyone can do it drunk!!!
( however,i have found nothing, nothing, absolutely nothing, that makes the derig any less painful or quicker.)

seriously tho......played to a drinking crowd recently and was amazed at how less receptive to the visuals they were...( even had a guy come up and nonchalantly tell me that he took no notice of the visuals as he was only there for the music!!!).....this was big shame as for once we were set up alongside the stage and the dj had 3 fantastic female singers who ended up jamming with us and tearing it up when we put old acidyravey stuff on....was a privelege that the crowd did not really seem to appreciate, but hell i did! (does that count as A/V incidentally, cos they weren't singin tunes but singing our pictures?)

[Bearings]

Your drunk guy said he didn't take any notice of visuals and was there just for the music.

I can remember loads of events where people walk away saying "there were no visuals there tonight". They do get noticed and add to the atmosphere, but lets face it, when the majority of people go clubbing or whatever, they do go for the music.

Visuals I suppose, can be classsed as mood enhancers (another one for ya Lara).

Drugs enhance the skills, enjoyment and quality of performance up to a point and then they just enhance the size of your lips!!!!!!! At which point, the artistic element tends to disappear
along with the methodical approach you need to have, in order to keep up a 2 hour plus set.

I think we all need mental lubrication and everyone knows how much and of what they can work with. It's just having the self discipline to know where to slow down or stop. Free parties, especially.

That's coming from a DJ and VJ point of view.

[brain]

my favorite "up-all-night" secret drug is green tea... tea to DRINK not to smoke :)

it's the same as with other drugs: always go for the best quality and carefully check what you are doing - right temperature when brewing (not too hot), the leaves two minutes max in the water... add some ginseng into your insulated bottle and there you go. some types of tea have an amazing power and the effect lasts MUCH longer than coffee or energy drinks. even japanese first grade sencha is cheaper than speed! and hey, no comedown doom...

prepared like that you may also go for that other tea without tiring :D

yes unj is right, visuals should always be seen in the context of the event - something that might look silly in bright daylight might just be perfect at a certain moment during a night. the same goes for the music - i guess some dj sets that rocked the floor just don't work when listened to as a 6 hour recording. and then sometimes really good intelligent visuals just don't work in a club... especially if a fair share of the audience is temporarily retarded due to recreational intoxication... :rolleyes:

[holly]

Yeah, alcohol is definitely a visuals-killer. Ironic that we have to play in bars for smaller venues because what we do and how the bar stays open (selling drinks) are at opposition.

Pot is a standard because it is mild and so easily found, and the effects only last a few hours (about as long as you want to stay in a bar). Mushrooms would be great to give out at a visuals party because they make colors more intense without adding extras that are not actually there (like acid does), but it takes too long to kick in and the results are different everytime. LSD is strictly for the "I'm going to be here all night and part of the next day" crowd, and it makes a paper chewing gum wrapper as endlessly fastinating as the most well-crafted visuals.... Best test is when the crowd is completely sober.

Speaking strictly for the punters here. When I work I fly on just water or possibly a cocktail.

[murph]

I think I live in a fairly unique place in the world.

When I started going to parties, no drugs, didn't even think about it. Just lots of good music and good people dancing all night. (with free orange juice at 3am!)

For several years, the "boom" years, we had kandy kids and e-tards everywhere, bringing lots of money and lots of problems. These years brought us the loss of all our decent venues, the RAVE act, and a lot of burned out kids.

These days, there's one "anchor" club night, a bunch of smaller on & off club nights, and the occasional rave, though they're usually thrown by shady morons who also deal meth. The kids who are left have a real feeling of responsibility, so most of what we see at the club is drinking, not drugs. (cept when there's some big stupid trance DJ in town)

There's certainly still drugs of various sorts around, but either people try to keep their use on the D/L or do it at home in smaller house parties. It's still a lot of fun, we still support VJing, there's still events, but the two subjects don't really walk hand in hand. Parties/Clubs/Raves are fun, drugs are fun, and sometimes they're fun together, but it's not an automatic association.

[bluntfaktory]

the last time i smoked pot at a gig , and that's just one good hoot of some of BCs finest , i had to give my drives license to the promoter so he could tell my cabie where i lived because i could only not read my license because i couldn't remember where i lived ( or what my name was ) . needless to say next time some one said "hay Gordon your last name is Blunt right ? well here have a smoke of this one " i politely decline . cocktails are another one , once i had a few to many and tripped backwards off of the balcony i was working on . luckily as i fell head over heals i managed to dig my fingers in the edge of the balcony enough so as i hit the main bar below , directly in front of the club manager i landed on my feet like i had meant to do it , which was a good thing because at that point all 800 people in the bar had turned around to see the hole thing unfold . although this was about 7 years ago , in a club that's been close for 5 of those years , folks still bring it up like it happened last week , again not smart , and again if offered unlimited tequila shooters with double seizers chasers while at work , i also politely decline .:smack:

[julez]

soudns like a good idea bluntfaktory...i dont think alchohol seems to be ur forte. Maybe brain's green tea idea is more ur style:D

[fALk]

Me too for the green tea route... ppl look at me strange from time to time when I am on stage in front of 8000 ppl and take out my thermoteacontainer and drink plain ol tea. heck I always give away my free drinks as I never need them (usually I will get a bottle of water in addition to the tea). I do not do heavy drugs anymore as do fewer and fewer ppl around me. There are the "raver kiddies" that still are full of em but the older generation kinda growed up and there is now too much alcohol in the clubs over here. I do occasionally take some es mushies but only not to feel too old :)

of course people knowing me will notice that in addition to the green tea I smoke some of those green cigarettes regularly (daily) but this is just because my computer is sooo slow :) and over the course of time I got kinda addicted.... :)

As for the general debate I do think that a club is a kind of retreat space (as noted before by others) in which to take mind expanding chemicals. researchers have found drug use in all ancient and non acient cultures as a mean to expand our creativity and productivity. the club szene has offered an easy approach to drugs that would otherwise be hard to come by (if you live the normal white suburban western dream life without beeing exposed to the "underground").
So I think some people go to clubs for drugs, some people go to clubs for music, some guys go to clubs for chicks its all not the black and white picture. I have been to parties with 100% ppl totally out of it and also to parties with only drunken boys. A good mix is what I would love best. In general drug use is good for society if it is in some frame and noone overdoes that.

as for the connection between visuals and drugs... I think if the visuals are good you get people with and without drugs trip on them equally. Then there are those visuals who just appeal to drug users and I would flatly say that those vjs are missing the point.... (tunnels, fractals)

I think if visuals work for the people who do not use drugs then they will work for those who do take drugs as well.

there is so much to write about this topic but in the end we can not change anything. If there would be more relaxing drug policies from the government and and real understanding of what is really going on when taking drugs would just clear up all this dust. But unfortunatly drugs are evil or so the want us to believe.... :love:

[bluntfaktory]

has anybody tried Moca-Robious tea , it's a ground-up African root with little chunks of natureal caramel in it . so , good , and if you think this is off topic try it . if tea (the kind even mums like) could be like good drugs , this is it .

[Amukidi]

I just googled Moca-Robious and it came up with nothing!! (which I reckon is rare) but I am really interested in this stuff - maybe spelling??!

[brain]

i guess it's the south african "Rooibos" tea. but as far as i know there is no stimulating effect in rooibos... so this is getting quite OT ?? ;)

[Amukidi]

Yep I was coming to that conclusion! Off topic? mmm talking about tea!! For my money it beats the shit out of comparing laptop specifications!!! ;D I shall be experimenting with Green Tea on my next tour in October - look out for the VJ with a vacuum flask and mug by the mixer!

[myogenic]

look out for the VJ with a vacuum flask and mug by the mixer!

mine's milk no sugar please;)

[Amukidi]

Wahey Jim!! - what say you we get a tea-pot and all the trimmings? Jacking up on Earl Grey - I like the sound of that! And when it gets late, we can have a nice mug of Horlicks!

[brain]

guess on some future AVIT there will be workshops in genuine japanese tea ceremonies and dealers pushin' the latest designer-teabags to the most jaded VJs :cool:

[myogenic]

Wahey Jim!! - what say you we get a tea-pot and all the trimmings? Jacking up on Earl Grey - I like the sound of that! And when it gets late, we can have a nice mug of Horlicks!


lets live a little john! now don't acuse me of pushing or anything, but i've got some rare belgian drinking chocolate that we could *ahem* sample :D

[Amukidi]

You're on pal! - and for a chaser I've got a nasty little English Breakfast blend that'll knock the buttons of your cardy!